“Sol is taking rice and beans and seed money from children…”

Nancy Lieder

Still in the meantime a lot of activity had been going on concerning Sol’s little contribution.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tt-watch/message/6987
From: zetatalk@z...

Date: Wed Nov 7, 2001  11:07 pm

Subject:  The Hazelton Recipe

Posted to Preparation2003, the Mark Hazelton site, cross-posted here.

How to fleece those worried about 2003:

1. Go into the mailing lists of those taking the ZetaTalk message seriously and suggest various money making schemes to "help us all put together the money we will need to get ready" (direct Hazelton quote). Have folks send YOU the money.

NOTE: this happened repeatedly on the Troubled Times lists, causing Mark to be banned from them. Mark Hazelton was send funds from members taking him seriously and they never heard again from him. This is not something one can take to the cops, and few who get fleeced in this manner even admit to it, but they've told ME about it.

Mark Take-the-$$-and-Run Hazelton

2. Cobble together a book from various OTHERauthors work and sell it. Fail to tell those you scam that they can get the iinfo for FREE on the web or at the library, from the sources who provided it in the first place. Violate copyright. Plagarize. Claim you want to help while failing to point folks to the free sources. Spam mailing lists. Sell electronic copy to save yourself cost, and fail to send paper version promised.

NOTE: This is ongoing. If Mark were truly interested in your well being, he'd point you to the free sources of this info. Sitchin has a site, and is in the library, and his paperbacks are cheap. ZetaTalk (the reason for 2003 in the first place) is entirely on the web, and free. Troubled Times is chuck full of info, the nonprofit having a booklet downloadable, etc.

Mark Plagarize/Ripoff Hazelton

3. Arrange with a friend in Sweden to get ready to launder a lot of money from desperate folks eager to join a site in a relatively safe area.

NOTE: Mark has a friend in Sweden, Lee Jones, reportedly his dad but in any case someone who speaks highly of Mark as though a disinterested party. Does he actually live in Sweden? Who knows, as Mark and his "dad" share the same
TCP/IP subdirectory, same location, and false locations, bouncing e-mail forward to forge the actual location, are an easy thing for a hacker to do.

Mark I've-Got-Friends-in-Sweden Hazelton

4. If banned from the place folks concerned about 2003 will congregate (i.e. the Troubled Times lists), setup your OWN list (Preparation2003) and get
the welcome committee at tt-welcome to stear folks your way.

NOTE: This actually happened a couple months ago, though I'm still stunned at the magnitude of the poor judgement. The tt-welcome monitor knew Hazelton had been banned, and why, yet steared masses of newcomers to Preparation2003 list herding lambs to the slaughter. I can only ascribe it to gullibility, con-artist skill on the part of Hazelton, or temporary insanity. I'll be kind and take the later.

Mark I-Played-Him-Like-a-Violin! Hazelton

5. Pretend that your new mailing list is actually DOING anything new, while pointing folks to the Troubled Times TOPICs where the actual content for preparation is laid out and available.

NOTE: Mark is an old hand at plagarism and self agrandizement. In his words, "why NOT" when asked about the ethics of taking others efforts for your own gain.

Mark Plagarize/Agrandizement Hazelton

6. As panic over 2003 sets in, talk up Sweden andsuggest all pool their money and GO there. Money sent ahead of time, of course, to get a site and supplies, and of course, sent to trustworthy Mark and associates. Anyone actually getting into Sweden discovers a PO Box at most, no trail to Mark and associates who are virtual.

NOTE: ZetaTalk and Troubled Times stressself help and keeping a low profile, and warms about these types of rip-offs. See next post.

Mark I-Can-Save-You Hazelton

[I guess by that you can gather she doesn’t like Mark Hazelwood, when she gets his name right. Notice the emotional slant.]

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http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tt-watch/message/6993
From: “Sol" <volimerc@y...>

Date: Thu Nov 8, 2001  12:18 am

Subject: Re: [tt-watch] The Hazelton materials

Nancy, it's a bummer that you don't appear to realize how badly your personal attack on Hazelwood is hurting the credibility of ZetaTalk and of your entire message. I'm in shock, personally, and I would imagine many others are as well.

I was also here during the "Hazelton ripoffs", but I don't seem to remember that it was so bad. In your letters you describe him as some kind of a monster, that's ridiculous. Which horrible ripoffs did he perpetrate upon our innocent membership? My   understanding is that he convinced someone to get involved in a pyramid scheme, that's all, and relatively small sums of money actually exchanged hands. Listen, I also got convinced a couple of times in the past by some silly friends to pay for a pyramid scheme, but I didn't think they were such monsters because of it. Everyone loses from a pyramid scheme, everyone can make a mistake. You're blowing it totally out of proportion with this.

That Prep list is not Hazelwood's, period. They're just a bunch of good people who want to survive, just like us, but would rather not do it in a place that's run like an army camp, which is what we are compared to them. They're doing a good and important thing with their preparations, spreading the message to more and more good people. They post a lot of valuable and interesting information, and exchange good ideas, just like us. It's true that over there they pay less "homage" to you as the Zeta Emissary. So what? Your message is still being spread, and you should be happy about it. Are all Pole Shift survivors going to be members of the Troubled Times, because others are not worthy or something?

I don't know if you've read many of Hazelwood's postings on the Prep list, but he always points to ZetaTalk and TT as the source for his information. So he has definitely not forgotten where he got a lot of his information from, and he gives you plenty of credit and reminds everyone of this at every opportunity. He also constantly defends ZetaTalk on that list from the real debunkers. Is that so bad? Are you so upset about the copyright ripoff then, is that it, or what exactly is so horrible about this guy?

And who in the world is "Lee Jones" from Sweden? If you mean Lee from tt-welcome, he lives in a village in Alabama. But nobody with that name has posted on the Prep list for nearly a month.

Sol

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http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tt-watch/message/7009
From:  "Jan" <anybody@a.. .>

Date: Thu Nov 8, 2001  9:47 am

Subject:  Re: [tt-watch] The Hazelton materials

Listers,

Unfortunately, few humans fully understand the concepts of Service-to-Others (STO) and Service-to-Self (STS). You don't have to be a Mother Teresa to be STO, nor do you have to be part of the mob to be STS.

[So Mr Rypdal knows more than us and fully understands the concept of STO. So he’s now the “expert,” O don’t think so.]

Many STOs may be seen as arrogant and bitchy, when they quickly identify others as STS and dismiss them, or when they determined & forcefully carry out their missions. You may know that Mother Teresa was known for running her operation with a will of steel, and she was not all that popular with those working for her.

[Good bit of arse cover there, by showing that good has to be bad makes everything OK.]

Many STSes on the other hand use their best efforts to be seen as friendly & warm, caring about others etc., when their ultimate goals are for their own personal benefit only. Unfortunately, in this mixed world, only a few are able to see through the smoke and mirrors, and those that do, are often called conspirators. Most of those that know about these mechanisms are STSes themselves, or a mixed personality leaning towards STS. If you have ever been in the board rooms or dealing with top management of today's corporations, or are yourself a part of such organizations, this will be no news to you.

[Ok so we got the point, but to make sure we now hear about the bad being good.]

Time and time again have I met the Sol's of this world, unable to distinguish between STO and STS, being fooled by the friendly behavior of the STSes and their expressed concern for others.

[He’s now assuming he knows Sol well enough to categorise him as gulable, but then as we’re all here listening to nancy I guess that puts us in the same boat.]

Nancy is new at this game, and has not yet learned how to fight the STSes with their own medicine. (I.e. never say things directly, only hint at them; spread the word through 3rd parties instead of dealing directly with the issues etc.) A few years back, I was myself a little concerned about her & the Zetas being too direct on certain issues. With about 1.5 years to go, there is no longer any time for such issues.

[More excuses. I thought Nancy didn’t need anyone to speak on her behalf or fight her battles?]

I know nothing about Hazelton (or Hazelwood or whatever), but I have received enough information from the Zetas through the ZetaTalk site and directly from Nancy to know that they are truly STO, and that they are indeed telling the truth. I also know that scams like the one Hazelton is accused of are not uncommon. (In my part of the world, we have recently seen a lot of organizations starting up, fighting the Save the Children foundation, Red Cross etc., where it turns out that admin cost may be between 80 & 100% (yes, 100%), so that whatever contributions they get never gets to those needing it.)

[You know nothing about Hazelwood yet still feel experienced enough to pass judgement, knowing aliens that speak in Nancy’s head have told the truth. Not exactly a good recommendation.]

 I would say that the main problems here are:

• That one of the TT officers are showing such lack of understanding in the main ZetaTalk message on STO and STS behavior, and

• That said TT officer attacks another TT officer & VP in public. In any ordinary organization, I would call for an immediate dismissal of that officer from any duties within the organization.

[TT-officers are not supposed to be interfering with the groups and tt-member moderators were and still are not obliged to be 100% faithful or believers. Second no one is above moderation on the groups including Nancy as was discussed by the tt-posse itself. Third, everyone is entitled to their own opinion and posting it to the groups puts it in the public domain.]

This not being an ordinary organization, and our message being one of education (not only on the Pole Shift, but more so on the Awakening), I would hope this TT Officer immediately brings forward a public excuse to Nancy, and refrains from any such postings in the future.

Regards,
Jan
Internal Auditor

[Notice the last line “Internal Auditor”? He’s flashing his authority as he never adds that on any postings.  TT-posse has its own e-mail group where their messages are archived just as with the other tt-groups. You can bet there was considerable activity going on behaind the scenes.]  (See tt-posse)

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http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tt-watch/message/7011
From: zetatalk@z...

Date: Thu Nov 8, 2001  10:24 am

Subject: Poison in Moderation? NOT!

Our first nonprofit Treasurer turned out to be a con artist who ripped us off for the first $1,500 put into the pool. My money, I might add. When she blithly deposited this into her personal account, stated she'd send checks out paying things and had NOT, then claimed they must have been lost in the mail, etc. It was clear this was all deliberate. She had a ripoff scheme going in a UFO group she was an officer in too - selling bumper stickers, and wanted to do the same for us.

[Some good those know it all aliens are if they can’t waen you of the bad guy’s. I thought they knew everything and could read people’s minds?

I had to buy a $1,000 video camera to record my deposition, had her prosecuted, and she was CAUGHT and forced to repay. Nevertheless, she almost did a death blow to the new nonprofit.

 
You don't lie in bed with these types, so SHED them. Sol is taking rice and beans and seed money from children, by his poor judgement. That's the bottom line!

[Taking rice and beans from children? Now that’s a classic example of emotional blackmail geared at a deliberate anger response from the audience.]

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http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tt-watch/message/7016
From: "Sol" <volimerc@y...>

Date:  Thu Nov 8, 2001  12:53 pm

Subject:  Officer dismissla? (Re: The Hazelton materials)

Well Jan, it's obvious that in your world, an "officer" of an organization is not permitted to disagree with it's "leader", no matter what that leader does. Even if it's not any kind of an elected administrative leader, but a person who's supposed to be bringing a spiritual message to us. By the way, Nancy's not the VP of TT Inc, Roger is. But it wouldn't change my stance if she were the President. A wrong move is a wrong move, and it has to be criticised.

You seem to think that any disagreement with Nancy is an "attack", and soyou say I'm "attacking" her here. That's ridiculous! All I did is say that she's wrong in her "Hazelwood mission". Is one no longer allowed to disagree here with the holy opion of another TT Officer? That'll be the day.

OK, Mr. Internal Auditor, you go ahead and call for my dismissal, as you've already called for the removal from this list of anybody who's ever posted an opinion contrary to your own. Meanwhile I'll continue doing what my conscience demands. I'm not shutting up this time.

Jan wrote:

<< I know nothing about Hazelton (or Hazelwood or whatever), but I have received enough information from the Zetas through the ZetaTalk site and directly from Nancy to know that they are truly STO, and that they are indeed telling the truth ... >>

We have all received enough information from the Zetas to know that they're telling the truth, myself included. We have also received enough information from Nancy to know that she's capable of getting carried away and not giving us the straight message. And we're invariably told by her that this information comes straight from the Zetas, such as a year ago in Ron's case. The "Zetas" told us a year and three months ago that if only Ron left Nancy's place, we would get large monetary donations and a movie out in no time at all. Well he left, and nothing happened. Great.

It takes a discerning mind to differentiate between the two kinds of messages we receive here. A good way to tell the difference, is when Nancy is giving us ZetaTalk on issues with which she's not emotionally an personally involved. When her personal likes and dislikes enter the picture, then it's anybody's guess what the Zetas really say about a particular subject.

Now you can kick me out for this blasphemy.

Sol

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